Lauren Jackson: Helping New Leaders Start Strong
Watch or listen to the podcast on Spotify, Apple Podcasts or YouTube.
In this episode, we’re joined by Lauren Jackson, founder of Kids Ministry Circle, for a practical conversation about one of the most overlooked parts of building a healthy kids ministry: volunteer onboarding.
Lauren shares her origin story in kids ministry, what she wishes she knew in year one, and why onboarding isn’t just paperwork — it’s leadership, discipleship, and protection. We talk through the full process from “someone raised their hand to serve” to helping them feel confident on their first Sunday, including safety screening, setting expectations, avoiding the “desperation trap,” and how to handle situations like weird vibes, ghosting, and student volunteers.
If you want volunteers who stick, a team culture that stays healthy, and a kids ministry that runs with excellence, this one’s for you.
In this episode, we cover:
Why casting a bigger vision attracts better volunteers
What a strong onboarding process actually looks like
How to set new volunteers up for a great first day
How to handle awkward conversations (and ghosting) with clarity and grace
Best practices for student volunteers serving in kids ministry
Quick Links:
KIDMIN U (Next session starts February 2026)
nextgenministrynetwork.com
Transcript
KIDMIN U Team (00:04)
Well, Lauren,
welcome to the podcast.
Lauren Jackson (00:07)
Thanks, I'm excited to be here.
KIDMIN U Team (00:10)
okay. Some people are listening to this and probably what they know you from is Kids Ministry Circle, which quick shout out to you. I think that's probably the most helpful Kids Ministry podcast out right now. Like when I go around and I ask people hey, what's the best thing to listen to? I think time after time, the top answer I get is Kids Ministry Circle. So free shout out to you. I also answer with the same response. That's why I wanted to have you on the podcast. But it is kind of funny.
You do this all the time where you're interviewing guests and you're the one asking questions, but now the tables have turned. How does it feel to be the one receiving all the questions?
Lauren Jackson (00:45)
You know, it feels good. It feels like I'm not like totally in the dark. I'm like, I know how this works. We use this platform for my podcast. It's a fun conversation that we can have. And I just, don't know, anytime I can chat kids ministry, it's always a gift.
KIDMIN U Team (01:01)
Yeah, plus it's way more fun being a guest because if this thing crashes and burns, it's on me, not you. Yeah, but it's not going to today. Listen, one of the things I'd love to start with is talking about your origin story. Because I think we see Lauren Jackson, founder of Kids Mystery Circle. We see all the cool things that you do. I think what would be interesting to me and maybe other people is figuring out how you got started.
Lauren Jackson (01:06)
It's your fault. Yes.
KIDMIN U Team (01:25)
So tell us a little bit, how did you get started in kids ministry?
Lauren Jackson (01:29)
Yeah, that's a great question. I was born and raised in Southern California and my parents were heavily involved in our local church. My mom was on staff for a season and so I have the perspective of a staff member's kid. But also like my dad was the kind of dad who took off work to be at VBS and he led small groups and my mom made
bunk kick after bunk kick for all the different events that we would have in our church. so my parents were heavily involved in just that kind of like you think of late nineties evangelical church, like my parents did all the things. And that got me connected to the local church. And I just happened to have a lot of adults in my life who really cared for me.
And kind of, they pointed out leadership giftings in me before I even saw them, gave me opportunities to lead in ways that most people don't get to. And so I always kind of say that I graduated from kids ministry, but never really left kids ministry. ⁓ As a middle schooler in high school, I always kind of found my way back into the kids ministry hallways. And then as I got older, you always ask the question of like, well, what do I want to do when I grow up?
I went to school here in Colorado. I went to Colorado Christian University kind of to be in more of like the event planning side. That's what my dad does for his career. He's an executive director of a nonprofit. and I kind of like was like, I'll just do that. It sounds really fun. I'm very administratively gifted. And then actually one of my roommates was like, Hey, you talk about kids ministry nonstop. And so I kind of didn't realize that kids ministry could be a career.
KIDMIN U Team (03:09)
Okay.
Lauren Jackson (03:15)
And so that kind of, shifted gears. added a child psychology minor to my degree. And that's kind of how I got into the kids ministry world. I started working, I interned, started working for churches in the area and then kind of have been in this world ever since. And like through many different positions, both good and bad, right? Ministry is both hard and amazing at the same time.
My husband was also in vocational ministry. We served together on staff. We've served separately. We've served at two different churches, which I don't recommend. and that's like a whole other podcast, but, there was a season where I wasn't on staff and this was about four and a half years ago. I wasn't on staff anywhere. I had two small kids. My kids were super young and I was like, I have all of these things. I have all of these thoughts. have all of these stories and experiences and
things that I think would help the kids ministry leaders in my world. And I was in, we had done the church planting thing. I have seen friend after friend after friend step down from ministry because they weren't encouraged and they weren't equipped to do their job well. And so that's kind of how kids ministry circle came to be of like, well, I want to fill that void. I want to be a place where kids ministry leaders feel encouraged and equipped to love and serve the local church, to love their church and serve it well.
and serve it with joy and serve it with excellence. And so that's kind of how Kids Ministry Circle came to be.
KIDMIN U Team (04:39)
Wow, that's incredible. And I agree. I mean, I think there's a big need for as many things as there are already to invest in kids ministry leaders. There's still not enough. Cause I mean, I know you've talked about this a little bit in various platforms, but there's a trend happening where there are really great kids ministry leaders who are leaving ministry cause it's just overwhelming. They're burned out. And then I think you've also got a younger generation of leaders who are looking at that and saying, no, thanks.
Lauren Jackson (04:46)
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
KIDMIN U Team (05:08)
Like I see what they went through and I don't know if I wanna put myself in that type of environment. I know for me, listen, I worked in the local church for 14 years and just now recently have stepped out to do things like this. But even for me, was like, there's been 14 years. It feels like kids ministry is ⁓ like a young man's game and I don't feel so young anymore. I feel like kids ministry ages you really fast. So I love the fact that you're invested in the community because we need it. We need to raise up the next generation of ministry leaders.
Lauren Jackson (05:11)
Yep.
Yeah
KIDMIN U Team (05:37)
In your little intro, you mentioned something about maybe some people who saw potential in you before you saw potential in you. I wonder if anybody comes to mind and if there's anything you're willing to share about that, because I think each of us probably has a person like that in their store.
Lauren Jackson (05:44)
Mm-hmm.
totally. My kid's pastor when I was in, I think it was middle school, she did a lot of different things. She ran a Christian theater company. I like little background, I did Christian theater growing up, which is like, I feel like classic kids ministry opportunity there. So I did that with her and then she started working at the church that we were at. And she was really the one that like she would
Back in the days where you could do this, she would be like, hey, I'm going to Costco, hop in the car with my three girl. She had three girls and I just did so much life with her. I babysat for her. I had a frontline view of how she raised kids in ministry, how she handled hard things. I saw the church really hurt her and her family and just how she navigated that.
was so like looking back after going through like our own season of hard things with the church, it's like, ⁓ I was able to watch that so that I could go through this. And she's still like one of my best friends, my mentor. I text her all the time. We catch up all the time. And so it's people like that who now she's still in vocational ministry. She's still serving the local church. And now we get to
link arms and do things together and collaborate on things and share projects and share ideas. I learned so much of what I do and how I teach and how I lead because I watched her. And it was in the small moments, the moments that she let me in to certain decisions. I I watched her get up on stage at VBS in front of a thousand kids, scrap her entire lesson and teach something different because that's what God was asking her to do.
KIDMIN U Team (07:37)
Wow.
Lauren Jackson (07:37)
And it's like, I watched her do things like that. And I'm like, that was so impactful for me and my growth and my leadership. And not just here's how you recruit volunteers, but it's here's how you have discernment on what God is asking you to do as you lead and disciple and come alongside families and make decisions and navigate with your church staff and.
experience really hard seasons and go through your own suffering while you're caring for all the, it's just like, there's, kids ministry is so much more than what we're gonna talk about today, which is so integral to kids ministry, but it's so much more than that. And those were the things that I got to see so that I didn't jump into my first job and think, why didn't anybody tell me that this was how ministry really was? I, in a lot of ways, I got to see it firsthand, so.
KIDMIN U Team (08:34)
Wow. Yeah, I mean, listen, we're both in the coaching space and so we spend our time investing in people. But to your point, I think there's no substitute for seeing a real person with real situations, know, the stuff that's not gonna be covered in an online course or even in a coaching call. You got to see the way she lived her life. You got to see her rhythms. You got to see her make hard decisions and take risks, you know, like VBS and scrapping.
Lauren Jackson (08:44)
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
KIDMIN U Team (08:59)
everything just because she felt like this is what I'm supposed to say yes to right now. Yeah, it's huge. And I think for each one of us, we have different people in our story. I could think of two guys, one who was like a mentor to me who I volunteered in his room with forever. And then also I had a guy kids pastor growing up. And to be honest, I don't, it's a little bit more normal to have guys in kids ministry now, but at the time it wasn't. And I don't know.
Lauren Jackson (09:09)
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
KIDMIN U Team (09:26)
if I would have even thought of this as a career unless I had seen an example of it in my own life. So it's amazing to see the way that the Lord puts like people in strategic spots in our life at just the right time, because if that person wasn't there, we might not have Lauren Jackson and everything that you bring to our community as well and all the churches that you've served at, which is incredible. Okay, so you've been in this for a little while. Today we're talking about volunteer onboarding, which the way we're defining it is,
Lauren Jackson (09:43)
Yeah.
KIDMIN U Team (09:54)
Somebody has raised their hand. They said, I want to serve on the team. Maybe they filled out an application. Onboarding in my mind is screening and then helping them start on your team. Kind of that. We'll probably spend more time on you know, their first day and helping them start strong and all that stuff. But with all this stuff in mind, we're talking about your origin story and the beginnings of your kid's ministry career. What would you say to Lauren in year one of her career?
Lauren Jackson (10:02)
Mm-hmm.
Yeah, that's a great question. think looking back, I didn't know how to communicate accurately the importance and value of kids ministry. So I think looking back, I think I would have pressed a little bit harder of the why behind the what and be able to communicate with volunteers. This is not easy.
I think sometimes kids ministry leaders are like, it's so easy. Like you just serve, you jump into a classroom, you sing some songs, like no big deal. It's just, it's like one and done. It's so easy. I think I, and I fell for that as a young leader of just trying to get people in the classroom of like, no, you can do it. It's not a big deal. I think I would have pressed a little bit harder on the, no, this is a big deal. And by you saying yes to this big deal,
KIDMIN U Team (10:46)
Hahaha!
Yeah.
Lauren Jackson (11:09)
you could be impacting generations for decades because you are choosing to show up on a Sunday morning. And so I think I would have casted a bigger vision, not just, hey, serve our parents by watching their kids. No, no, it's invest in the next generation by telling them about the true and better story and the only one that can save. And I think I was not bold enough. I think as a young leader,
I just was, I was more concerned with getting people in the classroom and like playing nice than like actually stepping up and saying, no, no, I'm confident that this is a big deal and I need all of my volunteers to understand that it's a big deal. And I also started serving back when safety was not a big deal. And so like, I feel like the safety conversation has exploded over the last 20 years.
KIDMIN U Team (11:57)
Gosh.
Lauren Jackson (12:05)
And so, like I remember my first like big girl kids director full-time job, I was 21 and we lived in Colorado. And so the active shooter conversation was legit. Like it was a real thing. And I would, yes. Yeah.
KIDMIN U Team (12:20)
Wait, can I just ask, because I know about Aurora, Colorado, like where
did that fall around this timeline? Was that pretty fresh?
Lauren Jackson (12:27)
Yes, that was, that happened when I think it was like our senior year of college. Because I remember, I remember texting my boyfriend, which is now my husband of like, Hey, you didn't go see soup, Spider-Man or whatever movie it was. Like, are you alive? ⁓ Which we wouldn't have like, we were so far away from that, that it would not have, they would have never gone down to that movie theater.
KIDMIN U Team (12:44)
gosh, what a text.
Lauren Jackson (12:50)
But anyways, like I remember talking about it. But also, my pastor at the time was slightly controversial, which is again, a whole other conversation. And so we were the city in Denver. We were hyper aware that our senior pastor was saying these things, getting these reactions. it just, like it was a common conversation. And so if I were to go back, I would,
KIDMIN U Team (12:53)
Yeah.
Hmm.
Lauren Jackson (13:20)
be really strict on safety and then cast a better vision.
KIDMIN U Team (13:25)
Yeah, You know, it's interesting you say that because I'd never really thought about safety not being as big a deal in a different era. But now that you mention it, you're so right. I mean, when I got started, it's like it's always mattered. But I think there are maybe specific things that we're hyper sensitive to now that we probably weren't 10, 15, 20 years ago. And especially the active shooter thing.
Lauren Jackson (13:34)
Yeah.
Mm-hmm. Yeah.
KIDMIN U Team (13:50)
I know for me as a guy in kids ministry, a lot of stuff has come out about like men and sexual abuse and stuff like that. So that's always been a thing I've had to be mindful of with our guy volunteers and over communicating our safety practices to parents about what we do. I wonder, we fall into this temptation sometimes of trying to make it seem like all you have to do is this to a potential volunteer.
Lauren Jackson (13:56)
Mm-hmm.
Right.
KIDMIN U Team (14:13)
Like it's so easy, you just give like an hour of your time and all you do, you just follow the leader guide It's gonna be a walk in the park because I feel like we have this need to get people in. We're desperate for volunteers. But like you said, there's value in casting a bigger vision. How do you fight that temptation? all of us feel the pressure to get more people on our team. And there's probably a fear that if I do cast a big vision, if I do talk about the challenge in it,
that I might turn people away, that I might not actually get to fill my team with the amount of people that we have. How do you not fall into that trap?
Lauren Jackson (14:48)
I and I feel this way now, I didn't used to feel this way. You have to rely and trust that God is gonna bring the right people to your team. And if you give them false information, if you say, I'm gonna advertise it as this, but then that volunteer jumps into the classroom is actually like, hey, why didn't you tell me that?
this was hard or why didn't you tell me I was gonna have to teach a lesson or why didn't you tell me that I had to change diapers, right? It's like, if you don't tell them that, then they're going to feel fooled and then they're not gonna serve. And so if you want people to stick, you have to be honest with them. And I would rather have people who want to be there. Now you will always have volunteers who are serving out of obligation. My kids in your ministry, I'm going to give my time.
We love those people. Those people can still take the vision and run with it. They're there. They feel like they are called there for a season because their kids are utilizing the ministry. Great. But I want people who actually see that what they're doing is kingdom work and they are a disciple who is discipling. And I would much rather invite somebody into that.
than say, this is just like, it's an hour of your time, it's not a big deal. Because honestly, I think you're gonna get more people when you cast a greater vision. Nobody wants to be a hole filler. People want to feel empowered, they want to feel like what they're doing matters and is kingdom work and is important in the life of the next generation. And so I think if you're casting that big vision and inviting people in to be a part of a team and
do work that matters, you're gonna get more volunteers. And so I'd rather say no to the people who are expecting to show up and sit in the corner on their phones because in the long run, they're not gonna stick around very long anyways. And so, no, they're not. And so it is like, how do I balance that? I have to put my people pleasing behind me. I have to say,
KIDMIN U Team (16:50)
Yeah, and those aren't the people you want.
Hmm.
Lauren Jackson (17:03)
hey, if you don't feel like this is a good fit, then let's find somewhere else for you to serve. If you wanna be a whole filler, you can go make coffee. like, that, I mean, coffee is important, hello, I drink coffee every day, but it's like, this is a mindless task. And so it is, it's an entire church conversation, right? Because if, from the top down, if we are casting vision for a culture of volunteers,
it should trickle all the way into kids ministry and hospitality and making coffee. And so it's a hard situation to be in because everybody needs volunteers. Like I was just filling a hole for Sunday because we need an extra volunteer, but I'm not gonna just pull someone off the side of the road or like from our lobby and say, jump in. I'd rather close a classroom and invite parents to sit with their kids in service.
and have it be that, which again is a whole other church-wide philosophy and conversation of the culture around your volunteers and the culture around serving in kids ministry. So it's not as black and white, it's very nuanced. But part of it is just like, have to be okay and you just say, okay Lord, who are the people that you have for me this Sunday? It's everyone who has is Green and Planning Center.
KIDMIN U Team (18:15)
Mm-hmm.
Lauren Jackson (18:22)
and then we're gonna, we are going to survive with what you have provided and the work that I have done in tandem with what God is doing. So it's kind of harsh.
KIDMIN U Team (18:33)
Yeah. Yeah.
No, it's harsh, but it's true. And I think what I hear you saying is kind of that mindset where it's either a scarcity mentality or an abundance mindset. I experienced this recently where there was my own coaching program, a thing that I was going through as a participant. And I was on essentially a sales call, you know, they're trying to like win me over on it. And I was blown away by this guy's mentality. Like he
Lauren Jackson (18:44)
Yeah.
Mm-hmm.
KIDMIN U Team (18:59)
not be bothered if I said no. He was fine. He was totally secure if I said no. And he knew that what he had was something that I would benefit from. And by the way, I did. I ended up saying yes and it was a great investment. But I realized something about his demeanor and his mindset and even the way that he would talk. because he wasn't so desperate, I actually was more interested in the thing. And I think for a lot of kids ministry leaders, we feel desperation.
Lauren Jackson (19:19)
Mm-hmm. Yeah.
KIDMIN U Team (19:25)
We know the need that we have. I know that I need X amount of volunteers. And sometimes we let that desperation just creep into our conversations. And I think what we think we're doing is like making it more palatable for people to say yes to. But what we're really doing is being a real turnoff. at least to the right type of leaders, to the type of people that you want. Because if you recruit somebody who's, you know, asked to do the bare minimum, all you're gonna get is the bare minimum.
Lauren Jackson (19:29)
Right.
Mm-hmm.
KIDMIN U Team (19:51)
And you may not even get that, they might quit pretty quickly too. But if you invite somebody into a vision and cast, you know, this goal, this challenge that we're going through together, this is what we want to see in our kids and families, you're going to attract a whole new type of leader. Like everything that you're saying, the bar is going to get higher when you set it higher.
Lauren Jackson (19:51)
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
KIDMIN U Team (20:11)
So we're talking about onboarding, which again is part screening, part welcoming them onto our team. Maybe for just context on this, I'd love to hear about your process. So somebody says, hey, I wanna serve in kids, they fill out an application. What are your steps that go from that point in time to their first day on a team?
Lauren Jackson (20:30)
Yeah, so my onboarding process is, I would say it's quite extensive. Again, it's like we want to make sure that we're putting safe people in there. We want to make sure that these people, one, are a Jesus follower, but two, also can understand and communicate the gospel. And so we do have them go through quite a few steps to enter into a classroom. And so like basic overview of an
of my onboarding process. Again, there's a handful of ways that you could do this, but it's like ⁓ they fill out the application, they get dropped in my playing center workflow, we do the background check. One of my favorite things to do is do like a connect on Sunday, especially if I don't know them, then my first kind of thing is, hey, find me on Sunday. This is where I stand. This is what I typically wear. This is, have my name tag on.
come find me and I wanna meet you. I wanna meet you, I want you to meet me, because then that helps, it helps put a face to a name so you're not just sending an email, you're talking to somebody. And you can get some of those like small talk things out of the way and you can say, hey, tell me about how you came to our church or tell me about where you wanna serve or let me show you around, let me give you a tour. Do you have any kids? Like you can have some of those questions answered.
before you jump into the full onboarding process. You can also get some things on the calendar like, hey, you filled out the background check, that's great. Our next step is to go through our child safety videos and then jump in on Sunday. Is there a week in these next couple of weeks that you're available to serve on a Sunday? So you can do some of that in that connection point. so that see like connect on Sunday is a big point.
of the onboarding process for me. And then we are using Protect My Ministry for our child safety training videos. I've used Ministry Safe, they're both great. People are like, which one's better? And I'm like, well, I don't know. They both cover a lot of the same content. And so they watch that, we go over our policies and procedures. I've done in-person interviews before in onboarding process, which can be really helpful.
So that is like kind of an add-on of like if you wanted to have this extra level of security is you would do an in-person interview where you, I would always walk through their application, ask some more clarifying stories or clarifying questions, hear some more of their story. And then kind of it's like, I think we were talking about this, no, I was talking about this to somebody else this morning of like a vibe check of like, are you gonna like, are you gonna?
KIDMIN U Team (23:05)
Ha ha.
Lauren Jackson (23:07)
Is it, am I creeped out by like sitting across the table from you or like, you giving me weird, like what's the phrase? ⁓ No, like nonverbal communication. I was like, are you doing weird things? Like, is this a yellow flag? And I've had a lot of people who like, I served on a team. I was a director and a team of coaches and all of them were interview trained. And so they did all of the interviews and I would have multiple times then be like, hey,
KIDMIN U Team (23:16)
Weird vibes.
yeah, yeah.
Lauren Jackson (23:36)
nothing comes up on their background check, but it's just like this, I get this weird feeling and I don't know if they'd be a good fit for our age group. And so we talk about it. so it's important, right? If you're building a volunteer culture, not that you're like judging somebody, but it is like, you can push in a little bit and have some more of those intentional conversations. And so interview can be really helpful.
KIDMIN U Team (23:53)
Mm-hmm.
Lauren Jackson (24:01)
And then we do like a shadow Sunday situation where they serve for the first time. And then we kind of go from there. So that's like an overview of the onboarding process.
KIDMIN U Team (24:09)
Nice.
Yeah, I love it. That's very thorough, but also personal. I like how you balance a little bit of that, because sometimes we forget to keep it human. You know, the people out there who are great with like administrative stuff, they crush it with these stats, but sometimes we forget that there's a real person on the other end, somebody who goes to our church who loves Jesus and we want them to feel the warmth. Okay, you mentioned the weird vibes. I think it's...
Lauren Jackson (24:16)
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
KIDMIN U Team (24:34)
Crystal clear what to do if on somebody's background check, there's like an actual thing, hard pass. But for the people where there's written, there's no reason you have to say no, but you just get a weird feeling. Have you ever had that and actually decided, hey, this isn't somebody I feel comfortable with on our team? And how'd that go?
Lauren Jackson (24:39)
Yeah. Yeah.
Yeah, I mean, if I like, I can think of a couple different scenarios where I've had a coach do an interview and they come back and they say, hey, they answered this question a little bit weird, or they didn't have an answer for how to communicate the gospel, or they just like, they didn't really talk at all and it was really awkward. And so then I take it from there and then I have a conversation with the person. Like we talk about,
in our application, we taught, asked the question, like, have you been sexually abused? It's just information that we like to know. I think it's helpful to help us care for that volunteer well. And so sometimes there's things that come up in their story that's like, hey, this is prompting a lot of emotion. Let me help you go through counseling or navigate that before you step into a leadership position.
or let's do it in tandem or something like that. So that situation has happened. People who don't know how to communicate the gospel or can't really tell you that they've actually accepted Christ, well then that's a different conversation, right? That's like, hey, we want all of our volunteers to be this level, like theologically, they don't need to all agree, but if you can't sign the statement of faith and you can't tell me that you've been saved, then that does not.
allow you to serve in kids because the whole goal is to communicate the gospel. And so then we direct them to serve somewhere else or I invite our senior leaders in. If vibes are just off, I usually meet with them and I have a conversation and it's like, let's talk about you as a person, as your personality. It's like, can you lead a group of kids? Can you be in an elementary classroom and command the room? And oftentimes the volunteer will bow out.
If I begin to explain, hey, this is what the role is, this is what the job description is, having a job description when you're onboarding volunteers is extremely helpful because you can go back and refer to it and say, hey, these are the things that I need you to do. Most of the time, they're like, hey, actually, I don't think that would be a good fit. Why don't I serve? And then it's like, great, let's put you in a different area. Let's have you serve somewhere else. We still want you on our greater volunteer team.
but I don't think a small group leader is the right fit. And so if you establish those expectations for your volunteers, then you almost use those as like a, these are our expectations. This is what we require of our volunteers. Can you meet these expectations? If not, let's find a way. And just because you're saying no right now, doesn't mean you have to say no forever. It can be, hey, work on this and come back, or let's have you shadow still.
and see if it's still a good fit. And so a lot of it is kind of having those conversations, but yeah, I've turned down volunteers who ultimately it wasn't a good fit and they needed to serve somewhere else on our team. But it's never a fun conversation to have, but sometimes it is just the reality of protecting. It's like shepherding and protecting the flock, right? It's like you are that final gatekeeper.
for your ministry and if that person is going to get in the way of kids feeling a sense of belonging, then there's other places to serve. And I think it's being really honest and having those ongoing conversations. And I am always one to let's bring in an elder, let's bring in our senior pastor, let's have a conversation with our XP and I'll say like, hey boss, have you met so and so?
KIDMIN U Team (28:24)
Hmm.
Lauren Jackson (28:33)
he wants to serve in, like I will always have those conversations of saying, hey, we did an interview, these kind of questions came up, what do you think? Have you met him? Can you talk to him or talk to her and like go back and forth? But it is, you wanna handle it with care. Like you wanna have that pastoral side and it's not just black and white. And that's like where
ministry is right. It's caring for people well and making sure that kids are protected but also that your volunteers feel cared for.
KIDMIN U Team (29:05)
Yeah. Well, and I think it makes me think, and this is loosely related, but it's this core idea that leadership happens in the tough parts, leadership happens kind of in the gray. Because again, if something comes up on the background check, you don't have to be a strong leader to make that judgment call, you know? Or if everything checks out and you get good vibes, again, easy decision. It's the times where it takes discernment and prayer and hard conversations.
Lauren Jackson (29:21)
Right.
Mm-hmm.
KIDMIN U Team (29:33)
That's why they pay us the big bucks. Okay, well, maybe not the big bucks, but they pay us bucks sometimes. listen, that's where leadership really comes out. And I think my pet peeve is kind of ministries and organizations that just create endless policies to protect them from having a hard conversation. Because what I hear you saying is there are multiple paths that this can take. So if we have such a rigid system that if they don't check this box, this box and this box,
Lauren Jackson (29:35)
Right.
Mm-hmm. Yeah.
Mm-hmm.
KIDMIN U Team (29:59)
then the only course of action is they can't serve at all. It's like, well, maybe that's not the truth. Maybe there are other places at the church they can do. We just have to recognize that serving with kids is a different type of responsibility. You know, we're not asking for perfect people, but yeah. Yeah. And listen, our responsibility to keep kids safe trumps all of it. when there are times where I have to make a hard call, the thing that makes it an easy call is when I remind myself the cost of
Lauren Jackson (30:02)
Yeah.
Yeah, it's a privilege. It's not a right. It's a privilege. It's a privilege. Yeah.
KIDMIN U Team (30:29)
the kids. what happens if I'm a coward right now? Then it actually puts our kids in a bad spot. So that's the sort of thing that puts a little fire in my stomach to be like, okay, we just got to do what we got to do, you know, for the sake of our kids. ⁓ Okay, so we've been talking about maybe the not so fun part of onboarding, you know, like the screening and all that stuff, making sure that somebody is safe, that they're healthy enough to speak truth into the life of a kid.
Lauren Jackson (30:29)
Yeah. Right.
Mm-hmm. Yeah.
KIDMIN U Team (30:53)
Assuming all that stuff checks out and we want them to start well on our team, how do we make their first day special?
Lauren Jackson (31:02)
Yeah, I think there's a couple things that I do in my ministries that I've been a part of as soon as volunteers are fully approved and fully through the onboarding process, then they get a t-shirt. And so our volunteers, when they wear a kids ministry t-shirt, that proves to everyone that they have been fully approved. So that's always a fun thing to say. It's like, you've done all the things that we need you to do to be a safe volunteer. So now you get a t-shirt, which is always a fun thing to give.
And then a couple things that I do, I make sure the volunteers have clear expectations before they serve. So I include things like when to show up, where to show up, where to find me, what to wear, what to do, what to bring, just like random things that would be helpful for people to know. And so they show up, I always do a pre-service huddle. And so in the huddle,
I say, like, hey, like we had a brand new volunteer this past Sunday, her name was Kenna. And I said, hey, Kenna's serving for the very first time in our kindergarten through second grade room. And we're super excited that she's here. Please make sure you say hi to Kenna at some point this morning. And so welcome her or welcome the volunteer publicly if you can and just acknowledge that. Side note, that also shows your other volunteers that you are working really hard to recruit more volunteers. So it just proves that like, ⁓ I...
KIDMIN U Team (32:16)
Hmm.
Lauren Jackson (32:18)
I wanna be on a team that's constantly adding new team members because it's fun. Our team is growing and that's a good thing. And so showing up and saying, hey, we're adding volunteers to our team just is a good example for the rest of the team. And so that's always fun to like acknowledge the new volunteer in front of the whole crew. Another thing that I do is I make sure the new volunteer is connected to a current volunteer. So I will say,
Hey, I'm gonna use Kenna as an example because it just happened. So I'm gonna say, hey Kenna, find me in the hallway, set up starts at eight. We're set up and tear down church. Set up starts at eight, come find me. And I will walk her to her classroom and I said, hey Kenna, this is Sarah. Sarah is our lead for the kindergarten through second grade classroom and she is going to show you how to stack desks, how to set up the classroom. Here's your curriculum bin. I had already sent her the curriculum and she had already looked through it because we talked about it ahead of time.
And so I was like, Sarah's your buddy today. So you can watch her, you can participate with the kids. And Sarah knows in advance. I sent a text to Sarah and I say, Hey Sarah, you're going to have a new volunteer in your classroom. Her name is Kenna, a little bit about her. She's never served in kids ministry before. So you are going to be kind of helping her understand kind of the flow of the morning. And so that's kind of, I want to make sure that they're connected to somebody in the team.
That's not me, because I'm not in the classroom with them. So connecting them to a person who is like a new teammate of like, hey, this is your new friend, your new teammate. You guys are doing this together. I often don't do a shadow Sunday where they just sit and watch. I'm often just like, nope, you're gonna do it. You're gonna learn by participating instead of just watching. Because I think
that's a waste of a Sunday, in my opinion. And so I'd much rather say, hey, Kenna, you take this five group, this small group of kids and do this activity and Sarah's gonna take that small group of kids and do that activity. We have separate large group teachers, so that's a whole other onboarding process that's different from our classroom volunteers. And so that Sunday morning is...
KIDMIN U Team (34:09)
Mm-hmm. Yeah.
Lauren Jackson (34:32)
and I check in or whoever's in the hallway will check in and say, how's it going? What do you need? Do you have any questions? Different things like that. And so then the follow-up is I text her on Monday and say, hey, Kenna, it was so great to have you serve in kids yesterday. Do you have any questions? Do you have any thoughts? If I don't catch her after service, then I will send that text. But most of the time I try and we also have to tear down and put everything back. So there's lots of times to chat in the tear down.
timeframe. So it is helping them feel welcome, helping them get connected to their team, making sure that they are prepared, but also know, like I'm very honest with our new volunteers of like, hey, it's going to take you a couple of times. It's going to take you a couple of times to figure out the rhythm, to get to know the kids, to get to know the curriculum, feel comfortable with it. And so just know today, today might be clunky, you're learning, you're growing as a leader. And next time you come in here, you're going to feel more confident and you're going to like,
be able to do a even better job than you did today. I don't know, it's not as like formal, but it is, it's very relational, it's very personal, it's very like, I see you, I see that you're in this classroom for the first time, let me make sure I check in, let's connect you to the team, let's make you feel like you are a part of the team. It's not this, hey, just come and watch.
and sit on the sideline. I'm like, nope, come on in, join the fun.
KIDMIN U Team (35:59)
Yeah, there's so many things I love about the process you just shared. One of them is the fact that you're connecting them to somebody who's not you. I think this is a shift that I think if there's anybody who's maybe a small to mid sized church, if you're trying to break the 200 barrier or the 500 barrier or whatever. if you're paying attention to this, this is the shift that's actually going to help you grow and move past because in those smaller churches, there's an expectation.
Lauren Jackson (36:06)
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
KIDMIN U Team (36:24)
that the pastor has a relationship with everybody. if you wanna get connected at the church, you have to get connected to the pastor, which is great. That's a beautiful thing. If you can do that, awesome. But there's gonna come a time where if your church grows, that pastor or even that whole staff isn't gonna have the bandwidth to have the level of connection with every single person in the church. But that doesn't mean that they can't be connected. the knock that people have on larger churches that I think is so unfounded.
Lauren Jackson (36:28)
Yeah.
Mm-hmm.
KIDMIN U Team (36:52)
is that they don't have the depth of relationship. I think that's silly. Actually, I think some of the most relational churches I've ever seen are larger churches who fight really, really hard to have systems in place to make sure everybody has a relational network or a small group or a team that feels like home and feels like family. And as a leader, when the pressure always falls on you to be the connector to everybody, that's a big burden to carry. If you can,
Lauren Jackson (37:08)
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
KIDMIN U Team (37:21)
Awesome, it's our job to shepherd. So I want people to hear me when I say this, this isn't an excuse to not be a shepherd. It's not an excuse to not care. It's a way to level that up and be more intentional. And when the time is right, maybe to scale as well.
Lauren Jackson (37:29)
Right.
Mm-hmm.
KIDMIN U Team (37:38)
you talked about the first day and everything and you mentioned a few different ways that you train people. I've found that there is this temptation to throw everything, at a volunteer before they even start on their first day. watch these 10 videos, read this gigantic policy manual. we just throw a lot at them. And I wonder if that's overwhelming.
Lauren Jackson (37:48)
Mm-hmm.
KIDMIN U Team (37:59)
What do you ask of volunteers before day one and how do you balance this need to prepare them without overwhelming them?
Lauren Jackson (38:07)
Yeah, I think we do have a policies and procedures document and then we ask people to sign, like read it and sign it. A lot of it is not super necessary because ours is like a family discipleship one. So it's both students and kids. And so like, I will highlight like, hey, this is gonna go through our bathroom policy and different things like that. When we...
As we kind of have launched this church, I have done a lot of video stuff. And so I will send a video that's like, hey, here's a reminder of all of our bathroom policies and different things for the specific classroom that you are going to participate in, like walking through the curriculum and doing things like that so that they can hear me talking about it and not just read it themselves. And so I have found that to be really helpful.
⁓ But also in our huddle time, we always go through policies and I'm a big believer in you remind people. Nobody is thinking about kids ministry like you are thinking about kids ministry. Everyone has lives outside of Sunday morning and everyone has things that they need to be putting their mental energy towards and it's not the vision of your kids ministry. And so you need to be repeating it every single time you have volunteers in your space. And so
It's never a new volunteer is never like without reminders and so when they serve for the first time they're getting consistent reminders over and over and over again either through a video that I'm asking them to watch of me talking to them or a quick policy tip or discipleship tip in huddle that morning and so they're always getting something from me and
KIDMIN U Team (39:28)
Mm-hmm.
Lauren Jackson (39:53)
A lot of it, I'm very honest in the emails that I send them and part of my workflow, I'm like, you're almost there. You almost made it. You're almost done. I know this is a lot, but this is worth it. We will go back to these things and we will remind you. I do offer a lot of encouragement because there is this big hurdle that people have to get over when they first serve, but it's not this expectation of like, we expect you to remember all of this every single Sunday. It's no.
We're here to help you and we're here to remind you and we're here to encourage you and equip you to do your job and as a volunteer. And so it is, the thing is it is overwhelming. It's supposed to be overwhelming. When you start a new job, it's overwhelming. You're learning the culture, you're learning your job, you are trying to figure out the volunteer handbook and all the things. And so it is overwhelming. And I don't know if we should make it less overwhelming.
Cause again, it's going back to what we talked about at the beginning of like, when you have people complete the process, that shows you that, they're in this, they want this. The volunteers who don't, maybe they need a reminder or maybe they just don't want to anymore and that's okay. And so you want it to be overwhelming knowing that this is not a one and done conversation. This is a constant reminder, a constant
point of connection of, don't forget, this is our policy, or don't forget, this is the bathroom situation, don't, like, you want to be that kind of leader that has very realistic expectations on your volunteers, but also know, hey, how can I come alongside them in this, what can feel like an overwhelming process? And I don't think it's that overwhelming. I'm like, it's not.
KIDMIN U Team (41:43)
Yeah. Yeah. Well,
I mean, it depends what it is, right? Because I think if it's practical stuff that's actually going to help them, I don't think it has to be overwhelming. But I wonder how many people just throw everything their way and don't maybe run it through a filter first of how essential is this? know, what could wait until month number two or what could wait until our regular rhythm and huddles? Which, by the way, if there's no other thing that you apply from this conversation,
Lauren Jackson (41:47)
Right.
Mm-hmm.
Right.
Yeah.
KIDMIN U Team (42:12)
then this, let it be that you should do huddles every single week. Because even on the day of, if all you do is say, hey, here's what to expect today, then it's worth it. But if you level up and you add stuff like training and whatnot, it takes the weight off, I've found. I feel like I don't have to put everything to a volunteer right at the front, right when they start, because I know, hey, once you hop in, so my rhythm, by the way.
Lauren Jackson (42:15)
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
KIDMIN U Team (42:39)
I had 13 pro tips that I would cycle through in my huddles. So that means every single thing that I thought was essential for them to know and be reminded about, we'd cover it four times a year. Like every Sunday we'd go through those 13. It was a combination of a few vision things about our church and our ministry. Some of it was practical skills for how to be a better leader. And some of it was boring details like policies that they just need to know. Like we just need to be clear on them. But when I know that I've got that in place,
Lauren Jackson (42:47)
Mm-hmm. Yeah.
Yeah.
KIDMIN U Team (43:08)
I don't feel like I've got to throw everything at them before their first day. Because I know they're going to get to it within the next three months,
Lauren Jackson (43:11)
Yeah.
KIDMIN U Team (43:15)
So I think it's important not to waste people's time and to really be strategic about does this help them keep kids safe? Does it help further our ministry? Does it help them feel more confident? And if it doesn't check those boxes, then maybe it can wait or maybe it's not essential. Your thoughts, do you agree with that?
Lauren Jackson (43:32)
Mm-hmm.
Yeah, no, I do agree. It's things like what comes to mind is, okay, maybe you have tips on classroom management. Is that necessary for their first Sunday? Probably not. Is it helpful for week four? Probably. I feel like probably you can do that. I also think it's a lot of it is our own communication. How are we communicating?
the onboarding process, if you say out loud, know this is, you probably don't need to read this, but we're asking you to read it anyways. Well, that's not helpful. Like in the email that I send, I do acknowledge, like, yeah, this is, cause I lay out all the things. I say, hey, here's what's coming your way. And here's how you will receive them. You'll get an email from me with a background check. You'll get an email from Protect My Ministry, blah, blah, blah, blah. It's like all the things of like, overview of what's to come.
KIDMIN U Team (44:06)
Ha
Lauren Jackson (44:25)
And so at the bottom, I do acknowledge, say, I know this is a lot of steps, but I'm right here with you every step of the way. And if you get stuck, if you lose a link, if you get confused or don't know where to go, please email me and I will help you work through this onboarding process. But nowhere in there do I say these videos are really long and they're not that helpful. They don't have a ton of important information.
KIDMIN U Team (44:49)
Yeah.
Lauren Jackson (44:49)
It's like,
no, it's when you value something and how you communicate the value of it, people are going to listen and say, okay, these child safety videos are important. I'm going to pay attention to them or this policies and procedures, it's long, but it's got really helpful things for me to do. So I'm gonna read it. And so I think it's how you communicate these things really helps.
If you are negative about it, they're gonna be negative about it. And so it's as you're encouraging people through the process, I'm honest, hey, those child safety videos will probably take you about 45 minutes. I watched them, it's probably gonna be about 45 minutes of your time that you can do on an evening or on a lunch break or whatever, or this policies and procedures document, it'll take you about five minutes to read through and then you can sign it. And so it is like being honest about.
how it will take people and then saving some of that stuff for weeks down the line if they decide to be a large group teacher or a lead teacher or whatever. It's like, hey, you should know this specific policy where the bathroom policy looks different for the preschool room than it does the elementary room. So what do they need to know? Well, they probably need to know the elementary one. So kind of, think that's smart filtering through of like what's on a need to know.
basis for a specific season, like right now, and I know this will come out not in November, ⁓ but like right now is the beginning of cold and flu season. And so I have a lot of conversations with my volunteers of like, hey, if your kids are sick, or if the kids that come into your classroom look sick, let's talk about it. And I can page a parent and all of our parents know, hey, this is our sick policy. And so some of it is seasonal, some of it's what is important to know and.
KIDMIN U Team (46:18)
hehe
Mm-hmm.
Lauren Jackson (46:39)
on what Sunday and how we talk about things. so it is, yeah, it's like need to know situation and you can always pour more information into them as they come across specific things.
KIDMIN U Team (46:52)
100%. And I think a couple things have helped me a lot is having an intentional plan of where I'm gonna hit certain things. some things I might hit on multiple times in different ways throughout the process. So for example, my version of an interview, I really enjoy doing a phone call. I know that sounds weird, because if I was thinking about a social thing, I probably wouldn't choose a phone call, but I love that like I'm unhurried. I can do as many of them during the week as I need to. know, it's just easy, the format.
Lauren Jackson (46:59)
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
KIDMIN U Team (47:21)
And on that call, we're gonna go through some interview stuff and I wanna make sure that you're safe and healthy and all that stuff. assuming everything checks out, the back half of that call turns into an orientation, like a very brief one. And that's where I'll share, hey, here are the top five policies I want you to know. And maybe it's the two leader rule and our restroom policy and whatever. They're gonna get that in a few different areas down the road, but those are things I wanna make sure that you hear.
Lauren Jackson (47:31)
Mm-hmm. Yeah.
KIDMIN U Team (47:46)
like multiple times, like these are the essentials, as well as some other things. Like that's where I'll share expectations. Here's what the commitment is. Here are the guidelines. Here are the goals that we're going after. So if I have a plan, if I know in my head, I'm gonna share this here, and then I'm gonna share this other thing here, and then they're gonna learn this thing here. if you take the time to just write those things on a paper and map it out, you'd be surprised and you could...
Lauren Jackson (47:46)
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
KIDMIN U Team (48:11)
you could accomplish
way more and it feels way less overwhelming when you get to it in a thoughtful pattern like that. But one of the total hacks on this, by the way, that I stole from a mentor of mine is he used to have an observation sheet for people when they're just observing on a Sunday. So whether it was their first day or they hadn't fully committed yet, whatever, they would just get this sheet and it had some things to look for, you know, so that you're turning that...
Lauren Jackson (48:17)
Mm-hmm.
KIDMIN U Team (48:38)
into less of a passive experience and more into like a learning experience. And so I created my own and that helped me maybe more than anything else I've ever done because now I'm taking what you said and what I thought of at the time is a wasted Sunday. And now I made it meaningful. Now, this is training.
Lauren Jackson (48:41)
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
KIDMIN U Team (48:57)
Well, when we have a volunteer and we're trying to train them before they start, they don't know what matters. They don't know if you're actually sharing with them a golden piece of advice because they've never felt the pain of not knowing that skill or that insight.
Lauren Jackson (48:57)
Mm-hmm.
Right.
Mm-hmm.
KIDMIN U Team (49:12)
And so when you put it on an observation sheet and they're seeing it in real time, it helps way more. And it makes them feel like they're discovering something for themselves too, which is really cool. Okay. I want to shift to some questions that we have from some people who are tuning in to this live feed, which is super fun because they're getting to actually see and listen to this months before it comes out. And so we already have a couple of questions on here.
Lauren Jackson (49:18)
Yeah.
Mm-hmm.
KIDMIN U Team (49:38)
First question we got, and I'm gonna throw this your way, Lauren, is how do you handle it when a potential volunteer ghosts you?
Lauren Jackson (49:45)
Mm-hmm. I try not be sad about it.
KIDMIN U Team (49:49)
Ha
Lauren Jackson (49:50)
I try not to feel the feelings, because it is. It's like, ⁓ did they not like me? Like, were they offended by something I said? And so I try and take the personal side out of it and either say, hey, they're not ready to serve. A lot of times, this happens a lot when people are brand new to your church and they're like, I love this church. I want to do everything. And they fill out the application. They're like, yes, I want to do this and I want to serve here and I want to...
KIDMIN U Team (49:55)
Hmm.
Lauren Jackson (50:18)
do X, Y, and Z. And so a lot of times churches have like a grace period of like, hey, you need to be attending our church for three months. We planted a church two months ago. We did not have that grace period because we were like, well, it's a brand new church. We don't do things like that. And so sometimes people get overexcited. And so that's why having that connection point on Sunday morning is really helpful.
KIDMIN U Team (50:33)
Hahaha.
Lauren Jackson (50:42)
to just have some of those honest conversations, but then also look at the person, like find them on planning center and say, hey, did they fill out 10 applications? Did they talk to so and so about volunteering and hospitality and so and so about serving on production and so and so about doing setup and turn on? Okay, someone needs to call this person and say, hey, let's talk about where you actually want to serve. And so sometimes people get overexcited and wanna do all the things and you have to kind of.
bring them back down to reality of like, let's pick one or two. Sometimes they stop going to your church altogether. And then you just have to say, I hope and pray that they find another church that they can get plugged into. And you have to be okay with that. Oftentimes, I found people in the lobby and I said, hey, I got your application. Did you get my email? And then we can have a conversation about whether they want to serve or not.
KIDMIN U Team (51:26)
Bye.
Lauren Jackson (51:30)
Most of the, then you have to kind of play age into it. Are they a college student and it's busy season for them? Are they an empty nester and not really tech savvy and don't like reading email? Like you're gonna have to like not take things personally and kind of go out big picture. And if a volunteer actually goes to and doesn't respond and doesn't show up, then you send the text or you make the phone call and you say, hey, we talked about you showing up here. We talked about you doing this.
Are you still interested? Are you still in wanting to be on the team? If not, that's okay. And release them from that, but you have to lead out in that conversation and be the leader. And so I think that would be helpful. That would be my encouragement is to call it out. Say, hey, we had talked about meeting this time and for you to come and do this or fill this out. And I haven't seen it yet.
Can I help you? Do you need the link again? And kind of, not like offensively, but don't be afraid of the hard and honest conversations and calling people to actually commit. So, we've talked a lot about having hard conversations.
KIDMIN U Team (52:36)
Yeah.
Yeah, no, I think it's really good.
Yeah, but I mean, this is ministry. This is what we do. And I would lovingly say if you're listening to this and that makes you really nervous about having a hard conversation, I think that's something to work through because this is the job. ⁓ And so, yeah, I I just think so much damage happens when we avoid the things that are necessary. And this isn't just leadership. This is life, you know?
Lauren Jackson (52:50)
Yeah.
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
KIDMIN U Team (53:13)
Some
things in life are difficult and they're not fun, but if we don't do them, there's a cost.
Lauren Jackson (53:19)
when we have the hard conversation, it allows us to extend grace. And if you don't have the hard conversation, you have no opportunity to extend grace, where it's like, if you say, hey, I thought you were gonna fill this out, or I need you to go through these videos, or I need you to show up here, and they don't, and you can actually open the door to a conversation when you just have no idea what's going on in that person's life. And so you get to open that door, crack it open a little bit, and say, hey, let me in, what is...
What's happening? Why weren't you able to be there? How can I help you? What do you need? How, again, it's going back to leading a team of volunteers is not this system that like runs like a machine. You're dealing with people. You're a pastoral presence on a Sunday morning, whether you have pastor in your title or not. It's like, you get to care and shepherd the people well. And sometimes that means helping them check their email.
KIDMIN U Team (54:12)
Pastoral moments.
Lauren Jackson (54:13)
or like log into planning center. It's like
some of that is some of those administrative things where you can show up and offer grace and be kind and so.
KIDMIN U Team (54:23)
Yeah. And it's important to, think what I hear you saying is that it's important to assume the best. instead of rushing to a conclusion, you know, giving them the benefit of the doubt, maybe there is an explanation, you know, whether they're a college kid and it's finals season, or it's, they're somebody who's not tech savvy. And it's not that they don't want to respond to you. It's that they barely know how to access their inbox.
Here's maybe a helpful framework that I learned from a mentor. if you struggle with confrontation and having hard conversations, steal this formula. Here's how it goes. You have the conversation, let's say it's with you, Lauren, and I say, Lauren, I really love this thing about you, right? It's almost like a version of the sandwich mentality. But it's like, hey, I really love that you do this and you prioritize this. Then part two, that's why I was surprised when I saw this thing happened.
Lauren Jackson (55:04)
Mm-hmm. Yeah.
KIDMIN U Team (55:14)
And then you get to the third part and it's just a question. Help me understand, dot. Help me understand what was going on. Help me understand like if there's something you need from me and then just be quiet and listen, right? So you're acknowledging them and you're actually giving them an out by the way. That's the beauty of the formula. you're saying, that's why I was surprised when you did this thing that's kind of unlike your character. you're actually giving them the benefit of the doubt a little bit. And then you're allowing them to actually explain themselves.
Lauren Jackson (55:18)
Yeah.
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
KIDMIN U Team (55:41)
If you have a hard time confronting people, that is the easiest formula to use where it doesn't feel like somebody's being attacked, doesn't feel like they're put on blast, and you're lovingly pastoring them in a moment. You're not forgiving what they did. You're not saying it was okay, you know? Because sometimes that's a slippery slope when we just let them think that it's okay to not keep their commitments, ⁓ but you're inviting the conversation, which I love.
Lauren Jackson (55:46)
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
Mm-hmm. Yeah. Mm-hmm.
KIDMIN U Team (56:09)
Okay, I wanna get to the next question. This might be the only other question we have time for. And I'm gonna shorten it a little bit, but essentially it's, how do you set up student volunteers for success in your kid's ministry? May as well leave it open-ended there. When you have teenage volunteers, how do you set them up to win?
Lauren Jackson (56:23)
Yeah.
I mean, this is a really, again, it's a very nuanced conversation because you have to look at the teenager. You have to look at how old they are, how responsible they are. You have to look at their family. Is their family heavily involved? Is their family currently serving? Some policies that I have in place, if kids are in middle school, if students are in middle school and they want to serve, I ask them to serve with a parent.
just because a lot of volunteers feel like then they have to parent the middle schooler in the room. And so our middle schooler students have to serve with a parent and then our high school students get to serve, but they are junior volunteers. They are not, you cannot run a background check on them. You cannot have them watch the child safety videos. That is 18 years and older. And so you do have to say, hey, you are limited to these things and that's okay.
I think there are ways that they can serve things like, if you have someone who, a high schooler who really loves to teach, okay, great, team teach with them, invite them to teach with you, help them, like you can have middle schoolers and high schoolers help lead worship. You can have them greet at the door and do all of these things, but I think it's okay to be realistic and say, there's only so many things that they can do.
I don't even let students take kids to the bathroom. And I think that's in the question of like, they are not adult volunteers. They are not fully approved to do some of these things. And so their job is a hundred percent relational. I tell our students, say, build relationships with these kids because one day you're going to be their small group leader and students or whatever. It's like, just you get to play. You get to have fun. You get to build relationships. And that is way,
more important than passing out snacks, which they're probably also gonna do. But if you frame the discipleship conversation of the only way you disciple is through the context of relationship, and that's what our students are there to do. They're there to build relationships so that my son who's four will go, ⁓ that's Miss Abby, and she's one of my volunteers in my classroom, and she just happens to be 15 years old.
KIDMIN U Team (58:15)
Hahaha
Lauren Jackson (58:37)
Like kids don't say, well, they're not an adult. I'm not gonna play with them. It's like, no, kids want people to play what they want to play games and be in relationship with people. And that there's no age limit on that, I feel like. So casting that vision of, your job here on a Sunday morning is to build relationships with these kids, have conversations, play games, build blocks, talk about the Bible.
open your Bible in front of them, like all of those types of ⁓ conversations around vision and things.
KIDMIN U Team (59:10)
Yeah.
Yeah, I love that. And I think the cool part about it, and I've always had to remind our teenage volunteers, is that they have a superpower. they have the superpower of connecting with kids in a way that nobody else can. Right. I mean, how many times have we seen kids just light up when their favorite teenage volunteer comes in and they're playing with them and they're talking about their week and whatever. It's almost like there is one less layer, one less barrier of connection than it is for an adult.
Lauren Jackson (59:18)
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
KIDMIN U Team (59:37)
Not that it's impossible, obviously, for an adult to connect, but it's a teenager's superpower. And so we can lean into that as we're casting vision. And also I would say for the people who are nervous about this, like hearing this, being like, ⁓ man, I don't know if our volunteers are gonna be okay with that. They might feel like they're not an official or a full volunteer. Listen, I think teenagers get it. They know they're not adults. Like they're used to boundaries and limitations and.
Lauren Jackson (59:43)
Mm-hmm.
Yeah. Yeah.
KIDMIN U Team (1:00:04)
I don't think they view that the same way as an adult. If you told an adult, hey, I can't have you do A, B, and C, because you're not a real volunteer. Adult volunteers wouldn't like that, but teenage volunteers get it. They understand. And the reason I know that is because I started serving when I was 15. I abided by those. It wasn't a turnoff to me. I was happy to help. I was happy to connect with kids. And it was really fun, like years later when people would give me opportunities for more, but...
Lauren Jackson (1:00:07)
Mm-hmm.
Right. Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
KIDMIN U Team (1:00:31)
I was never resentful at those boundaries. I understood it. So I love that. Well, that's kind of all the time we have for our core conversation as we're wrapping up. Lauren, where can people find out more about you and what you're up to?
Lauren Jackson (1:00:32)
Mm
Yeah, so the best place to go is on social media. So we're on Facebook and Instagram at Kids Ministry Circle. The website URL is nextgenministrynetwork.com and we do seasonal cohorts. And so I think when this comes out, we'll be getting ready to do our spring cohort. And so that's kind of it. There's lots of things there on the website, lots of ways to get involved.
Lots of fun things happening over on social media. So those are the best places.
KIDMIN U Team (1:01:12)
Love it. And for those of you who haven't listened to the Kids Ministry Circle podcast, which I find shocking, if you're in kids mystery and you haven't heard it, stop what you're doing right now. Subscribe to the podcast. It's a really good listen. Again, I think it's one of the most practical kids mystery podcasts out right now. So Lauren, thank you for coming on the podcast. Thank you for blessing our community and sharing your insights. And for everybody listening, thank you for tuning in. We'll see you next time.
